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Latest Forum Topics / China Fishery    Last:0.076 --  Post Reply
China Fishery - Low PE
SLPY69
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04-Nov-2014 01:17     
 
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Stockpicker,

On one hand you said " The given reason for converting the bonds from Copeinca to CF was for  combining Copeinca and CF under one roof,  maybe  easier for management and other reasons."

On the other hand  " Getting solicitation approved can' t solve the debt problem"

Of course it will help to resolve the debt problem and that is precisely why they are having the solicitation because it is important to integrate the 2 companies to form a " Greater China Fishery"

No one is asking why are they having the solicitation BUT why are they dragging the whole entire solicitation process ??? Why

 
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SLPY69
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04-Nov-2014 00:46     
 
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Exactly earning is more important but the loan issue has overshadowed the earnings of the company. 

" Fitch also argued that China Fishery' s  fundamentals remain strong  and  said the company is cash-generative,  in part thanks to the gradual refunds of $241.5m from the company' s pull-out  of its Russian pollock contracts."  

The given reason for converting the bonds from Copeinca to CF was for  combining Copeinca and CF under one roof,  may be  easier for management and other reasons.    The coupon rate is about 9%, maturing in 2017. CF present short term loans attracted an interest of around 8-9%   hence,   said to be a zero sum gain.   There was a loan of $250 mil approved earlier to redeem the bonds but CF probably returned it when it paid $500 mil to the banks early this year.  

Again you have contradicted yourself, " Getting solicitation approved can' t solved the debt problem." The sooner the sooner the solicitation is approved,  the quicker they integrate China Fishery and Copeinca under one roof, easier for management, making the company leaner and more efficient, Hence, improving profitability of the company. Once the rating is better, the interest rate for the loan goes down. Of course getting the companies integrate will help to solve the debt problem.

Wonder why they are being questioned ? The board &ldquo is not aware of any reasons for such price  and/or volume movements or of any information which must be announced to avoid a false  market in the company&rsquo s securities&rdquo , nor is it aware of any inside information that must be disclosed under stock exchange rules, said Pacific Andes in a statement issued on Oct. 27.

stockpicker      ( Date: 03-Nov-2014 12:37) Posted:



Moody said it considered to downgrade CF if it failed to get solicitation but they never downgrade when they failed.   Clearly,   earning is more important.   Getting solicitation approved can' t solve the debt problem.

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Qanghoo
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04-Nov-2014 00:15     
 
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Don' t think they did a placement of 200 mil shares in 2013.  From the SGX website, there was a one-for-one rights issue which doubled the issued shares from 1023 to 2046 mil. 

stockpicker      ( Date: 04-Nov-2014 00:00) Posted:



Right one for one,   at least one got chance to buy right.   CF made a placement of over 200 mil shares plus others in 2013 to raise money for Copeinca.   If Copeinca can bring better earnings,   it is a good thing.
Leongsan 
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Rights one for one. shares increase 100% ? 


 

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stockpicker
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04-Nov-2014 00:00     
 
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Right one for one,   at least one got chance to buy right.   CF made a placement of over 200 mil shares plus others in 2013 to raise money for Copeinca.   If Copeinca can bring better earnings,   it is a good thing.
Leongsan 
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Rights one for one. shares increase 100% ? 


 
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Leongsan
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03-Nov-2014 20:09     
 
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Rights one for one. shares increase 100% ?

stockpicker      ( Date: 03-Nov-2014 12:56) Posted:



This is what one should wary about.. almost 50% increase in ordinary shares



 

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stockpicker
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03-Nov-2014 12:56     
 
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This is what one should wary about.. almost 50% increase in ordinary shares



 
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stockpicker
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03-Nov-2014 12:37     
 
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Moody said it considered to downgrade CF if it failed to get solicitation but they never downgrade when they failed.   Clearly,   earning is more important.   Getting solicitation approved can' t solve the debt problem.
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SLPY69
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03-Nov-2014 08:52     
 
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SP, you have also capitalised and blogged on the loan issue that has affected the rating of the company. This issue should and could have been settled/resolved long ago. Why is it still plaguing the company ? You can' t help TL and the others are feeling BOD did not actively or even want to settle the issue. Instead allow the drag.

Why did they carry out the solicitation, when the teams appeared not ready to take it on. That is the reason, why many are feeling frsutrated and disgruntled.

Thrice they failed and still not settled. Why ??? Are they playing marbles or stalling for time ???

The world are watching. 

stockpicker      ( Date: 16-Sep-2014 20:25) Posted:



Two days to go.  U think Copeinca bonder holders will agree?

Copeinca bondholders continue to snub China Fishery consent bid

September 16, 2014, 10:31 am
 
Bondholders of the Peruvian fishmeal producer Copeinca are continuing to snub China Fishery&rsquo s request to amend terms to their bond, reports Bloomberg.


Accepting the request &mdash first unveiled in July &mdash would see holders of Copeinca&rsquo s $250m bonds  guarantee up to $1.2 billion in group debt for Singapore-listed China Fishery, which is part of Hong Kong-based Pacific Andes International Holdings and acquired Copeinca in August last year.

The new deadline is 5 pm  New York time on Sept. 18 after two earlier deadlines  &ndash July 30 and Aug. 21 &mdash passed without bondholders granting the majority approval required.


 

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stockpicker
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01-Nov-2014 08:21     
 
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Please google copeinca bond to find out.   The given reason for converting the bonds from Copeinca to CF was for combining Copeinca and CF under one roof,   may be easier for management and other reasons.   The coupon rate is about 9%, maturing in 2017. CF present short term loans attracted an interest of around 8-9%   hence,   said to be a zero sum gain.   There was a loan of $250 mil approved earlier to redeem the bonds but CF probably returned it when it paid $500 mil to the banks early this year.  

Kyoto2008      ( Date: 01-Nov-2014 01:50) Posted:



Bro, what' s this bond issue all about.       

Then besides this issue, the fishing grounds I assume are going to be out of bounds.

So much negative bibes.  How to invest in this co?

stockpicker      ( Date: 31-Oct-2014 19:26) Posted:



Not too sure why redeemption of bonds has become an issue.   It was a zero sum gain to use the debt money to redeem the bonds.   Think it is better to spend another $1.25 mil to sweettalk the bond holders,   allowing them to free Copeinca from the bonds.   Dun think the bond issue is holding up the stock price.   It is the expected poor future earnings, which,   once improved,   will lift the price skyhigh.


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Kyoto2008
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01-Nov-2014 01:50     
 
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Bro, what' s this bond issue all about.       

Then besides this issue, the fishing grounds I assume are going to be out of bounds.

So much negative bibes.  How to invest in this co?

stockpicker      ( Date: 31-Oct-2014 19:26) Posted:



Not too sure why redeemption of bonds has become an issue.   It was a zero sum gain to use the debt money to redeem the bonds.   Think it is better to spend another $1.25 mil to sweettalk the bond holders,   allowing them to free Copeinca from the bonds.   Dun think the bond issue is holding up the stock price.   It is the expected poor future earnings, which,   once improved,   will lift the price skyhigh.

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stockpicker
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31-Oct-2014 19:26     
 
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Not too sure why redeemption of bonds has become an issue.   It was a zero sum gain to use the debt money to redeem the bonds.   Think it is better to spend another $1.25 mil to sweettalk the bond holders,   allowing them to free Copeinca from the bonds.   Dun think the bond issue is holding up the stock price.   It is the expected poor future earnings, which,   once improved,   will lift the price skyhigh.
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EZ3626
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31-Oct-2014 09:11     
 
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Haha ... no doubt I have released all my holdings, but still Kaypo and will take a peep.

The loan issue has plagued the company after they have acquired Copeinca until now which is more than 1 year. 

They should have settled it awhile ago 3-6 months since  " Fitch also argued that China Fishery' s fundamentals remain strong and said the company is cash-generative, in part thanks to the gradual refunds of $241.5m from the company' s pull-out    of its Russian pollock contracts."  

Why didn' t the Management chose to redeem the bonds ? Or at least like what JMS has said get the loan approved, go to the bondholders and settled it or fired them by redeeming the loan. Why let the loan issue cloud the company for so long ? I don' t understand ... ?????

Anyway I have decided to switch channel, but all these questions are in my mind .... is there no watchman on the tower ? 

Wish all who are still vested all the best. 
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JMS213
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31-Oct-2014 00:17     
 
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About " Pacific Andes Damanzaihao on draft IUU list by Undercurrents News, at the end of it all, it is still about the loan. The Management should know that the crux of the matter is about the loan. Why are they not doing it .... I don' t know and I don' t understand.

Make no sense for them not to get the in principle approval for the $250m loan ready and meet the bondholders. Why is there a need to convince holders. Take our offer or You are fired. What happened to the board after winning Copeinca, now turned into a mouse. This is business and nothing to sweet talk with the bondholders. Are they playing game or what ???

On Monday,  Pacific Andes said is in talks to refinance debt, after  it  failed to convince holders of Copeinca&rsquo s  $250m bonds  to guarantee  up to $1.2 billion in group debt for China Fishery.

The Hong Kong-listed company  added it was not aware of any reason for the &ldquo unusual&rdquo fluctuation in its share price and trading volume seen on Monday, Oct. 27.

Of course the world is watch you and how you continue to drag the whole episode or saga.

 

SLPY69      ( Date: 30-Oct-2014 16:29) Posted:



The loan issue has been weighing and dragging on the company for far too long. The corporate bonds is not cheap and have to pay consent fee to the bond holders.

They should have redeemed the bonds 3-6 months ago, and integrated the companies and get the machinery running. 

By now the rating of the company would have been improved and look forward to refinance the loan at a cheap rate.

It is about time Management need to put their acts together. Let' s be patience

 

SLPY69      ( Date: 30-Oct-2014 08:48) Posted:



I agreed with TL. This whole process has no bite. Pretty obvious they are not ready for the negotiation. Why wait until now ?

The loan issue has been hogging the news ever since the acquisition of Copeinca. Next is the solicitation that directly affecting the loan. Next they pay big monies to a bunch of jokers who came back with nothing (a third failure to win over bondholders). 

Shouldn' t they have gotten the financing ready to redeem the $250m, afterall Fitch has already back them up 

" Fitch also argued that  China Fishery' s fundamentals remain strong and said the company is cash-generative, in part thanks to the gradual refunds of $241.5m from the company' s pull-out  of its Russian pollock contracts."  

Why do they need a solicitation teams to agonise over it ?

There is reason why investors are now very frustrated with BOD' s move. 


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stockpicker
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30-Oct-2014 21:03     
 
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IUU stands for Illegal, unreported and unregulated fishing.   Once the vessels are in the IUU list,   the Fishing Ports of many nantions would be closed to these vessels.  

Leongsan      ( Date: 30-Oct-2014 20:02) Posted:



Can someone please post what undercurrent says. Quota reached

Pacific Andes&rsquo Damanzaihao on draft IUU list




Mothership formerly known as Lafayette is on draft IUU list of South Pacific RFMO due to be circulated on Friday, just as Peru grants the vessel a belated authorization
 

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Leongsan
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30-Oct-2014 20:02     
 
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Can someone please post what undercurrent says. Quota reached

Pacific Andes&rsquo Damanzaihao on draft IUU list




Mothership formerly known as Lafayette is on draft IUU list of South Pacific RFMO due to be circulated on Friday, just as Peru grants the vessel a belated authorization
 
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SLPY69
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30-Oct-2014 16:29     
 
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The loan issue has been weighing and dragging on the company for far too long. The corporate bonds is not cheap and have to pay consent fee to the bond holders.

They should have redeemed the bonds 3-6 months ago, and integrated the companies and get the machinery running. 

By now the rating of the company would have been improved and look forward to refinance the loan at a cheap rate.

It is about time Management need to put their acts together. Let' s be patience

 

SLPY69      ( Date: 30-Oct-2014 08:48) Posted:



I agreed with TL. This whole process has no bite. Pretty obvious they are not ready for the negotiation. Why wait until now ?

The loan issue has been hogging the news ever since the acquisition of Copeinca. Next is the solicitation that directly affecting the loan. Next they pay big monies to a bunch of jokers who came back with nothing (a third failure to win over bondholders). 

Shouldn' t they have gotten the financing ready to redeem the $250m, afterall Fitch has already back them up 

" Fitch also argued that  China Fishery' s fundamentals remain strong and said the company is cash-generative, in part thanks to the gradual refunds of $241.5m from the company' s pull-out  of its Russian pollock contracts."  

Why do they need a solicitation teams to agonise over it ?

There is reason why investors are now very frustrated with BOD' s move. 

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EZ3626
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30-Oct-2014 14:13     
 
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Now I am into Yuuzoo, ... 

They should get the bond honder out of the way so they can integrate China Fishery and Copeinca .... into Greater China Fishery. Once that happen the interest rate will come down. On that note, I disagree with what you said. 

Just don' t make mathematical sense ... to convince the bondholders and failed 3 times and still no result. They should have quickly overhaul their loans .... banks are flushed with liquidity.

  Anyway I am not interested with it anymore, have since let go my holdings.

Good luck to those who still hold on. Haizz Yuuzoo is stuck but I am sure it will move soon. 

 
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EZ3626
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30-Oct-2014 14:04     
 
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Decided to move on. Still don' t make sense ... please read

Bonds Fall 



Copeinca bondholders are being offered $10 for every $1,000 in face value of bonds held, or 1 cent on the dollar,  as an incentive to consent to the covenant changes. If the minimum number, or 50.1 percent, of bondholders agree, that will cost the company $1.25 million. 

The yield on China Fishery' s 9.75 percent 2019 notes has risen 7 basis points this week to 10.576 percent as of yesterday, Bloomberg-compiled prices show. 

The yield on Copeinca' s 2017 bonds rose 19 basis points to 11.1 percent today at 2:52 p.m. in  New York,  reaching the highest in five months.
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stockpicker
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30-Oct-2014 12:20     
 
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EZ.   Commercial interest rate is low but the credit rating of CF not good   so any loan secured will attract   8% to 9% interest as was in the past..much higher than the Corporate bonds.   It will be better to raise Corporate bonds but no one will take if they pay lower coupon rates.   CF tried to psycho Copenica bond holders. Raising debts is never the answer.   Once can show good earnings,   the price will go up.

 

EZ3626           ( Date: 17-Sep-2014 08:51) Posted: 
Don' t understand, today' s the interest rate is so low. It makes more sense to refinance the loan and pay the bond holders and get them out of the picture. Stop wasting time trying to convince them 

Stockpicker, the bond holders are not stupid.   

Haha ... anyway watch and see
 
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EZ3626
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30-Oct-2014 09:27     
 
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Guys already told you awhile ago .... it makes no sense. Someone is manipulating the stock not to let it run and now you are convince. The movement in this stock is so tense. (said it before)

If only you have listened and come over to Wilmar (alraedy up) or W Corp (Yuuzoo) things would have been different. Now look at the uproar .... Yuuzoo just announced a new break-through in their game   .... it is going up up up.

Until the board better set thing right, it does look good on them. This whole solicitation look is like crafted out to sensationalise the loan issue. 

C' mon the train is about to move. Got to go ... bye

 

 

 

 

EZ3626      ( Date: 17-Sep-2014 08:51) Posted:



Don' t understand, today' s the interest rate is so low. It makes more sense to refinance the loan and pay the bond holders and get them out of the picture. Stop wasting time trying to convince them

Stockpicker, the bond holders are not stupid. 

Haha ... anyway watch and see

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