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dontbetray Master	03-Sep-2024 11:16        dontbetray About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	aragosta always shout at seatrium, he so infamous BinderyT      ( Date: 03-Sep-2024 11:08) Posted: there are toxic people everywhere, we have one in seatrium as well that resulted in entire thread got shut down by admin.   just ignore them. dontbetray      ( Date: 03-Sep-2024 11:04) Posted: now i know why you get agitated. now you shouted every marine. GUYS this aragosta is really at every marine counte
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BinderyT Elite	03-Sep-2024 11:08        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	there are toxic people everywhere, we have one in seatrium as well that resulted in entire thread got shut down by admin.   just ignore them. dontbetray      ( Date: 03-Sep-2024 11:04) Posted: now i know why you get agitated. now you shouted every marine. GUYS this aragosta is really at every marine counter aragosta      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 19:59) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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dontbetray Master	03-Sep-2024 11:04        dontbetray About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	now i know why you get agitated. now you shouted every marine. GUYS this aragosta is really at every marine counter aragosta      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 19:59) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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BinderyT Elite	03-Sep-2024 11:03        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Thanks, both.   Interesting.   For IT, if project-based, we have to recognise the cost as expenses and revenue is deferred (e.g. when in dispute).   But for our h/w division, cost is capitalised till revenue is recognised at delivery.   Smallboat1021      ( Date: 03-Sep-2024 10:51) Posted: Some modification/addition. 1) The two are LNG Carrier, not LNG-fueled container. LNG carrier are the most difficult commercial vessels to build, while LNG-fueled vessels are not that difficult. 2) Since the two LNG carriers have no customer right now, it will be recognized as YZJ' s own assets (inventory or PP& E if YZJ hope to lease it out before sold) during construction. So no revenue nor cost will be recorded. (The " cost" is recorded as inventory/PP& E in balance sheet instead of PnL, and when the vessels are sold, revenue and cost will be recorded once and for all (just as what YZJ has did on the Jack-up last year).  All in all, no worry on cost inflated by the LNG carriers order and instead YZJ has chance to sold the 2 at a higher market price than it was contracted. emailpeter      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 20:58) Posted: Yup, you & team here are very tack-sharp (and you added IT tech-sharp) in picking this up. In a LT build, each progress payment is deducted against spent cost, the difference can be taken to profits every payment interval. Usually cost is assessed on the high side, such that a bigger grand profit is taken at time of delivery. This is the norm, I think SB practices this. In the case of the 2 huge builds, customer is gone, any deposits are forfeited to profits. Cost is then capitalised until sale is made, where that huge profit is taken in one-go. Implications, the quarters towards completion will show no profits, all until sale is made. Anyone here know when the 2 ships is complete ? For sure 2024, and even 2025 profits are affected by this, then one big one when sale is made. My mention of escalation cost in contract, no totally bearings to above. It applies if say steel price soars or plunges past a determined level, both parties can adjust sale price to account for it.
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Smallboat1021 Member	03-Sep-2024 10:51        Smallboat1021 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 1   x 0  Alert Admin	Some modification/addition. 1) The two are LNG Carrier, not LNG-fueled container. LNG carrier are the most difficult commercial vessels to build, while LNG-fueled vessels are not that difficult. 2) Since the two LNG carriers have no customer right now, it will be recognized as YZJ' s own assets (inventory or PP& E if YZJ hope to lease it out before sold) during construction. So no revenue nor cost will be recorded. (The " cost" is recorded as inventory/PP& E in balance sheet instead of PnL, and when the vessels are sold, revenue and cost will be recorded once and for all (just as what YZJ has did on the Jack-up last year).  All in all, no worry on cost inflated by the LNG carriers order and instead YZJ has chance to sold the 2 at a higher market price than it was contracted. emailpeter      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 20:58) Posted: Yup, you & team here are very tack-sharp (and you added IT tech-sharp) in picking this up. In a LT build, each progress payment is deducted against spent cost, the difference can be taken to profits every payment interval. Usually cost is assessed on the high side, such that a bigger grand profit is taken at time of delivery. This is the norm, I think SB practices this. In the case of the 2 huge builds, customer is gone, any deposits are forfeited to profits. Cost is then capitalised until sale is made, where that huge profit is taken in one-go. Implications, the quarters towards completion will show no profits, all until sale is made. Anyone here know when the 2 ships is complete ? For sure 2024, and even 2025 profits are affected by this, then one big one when sale is made. My mention of escalation cost in contract, no totally bearings to above. It applies if say steel price soars or plunges past a determined level, both parties can adjust sale price to account for it. BinderyT      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 20:00) Posted: Any idea how is WIP in the 2 containers accounted for?   Some industry (like my IT industry) allow for rev and cost to be recognised by milestones.   But since no customer in this case, does it mean they have to temporarilly accrue cost only but no rev
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emailpeter Veteran	02-Sep-2024 20:58        emailpeter About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Yup, you & team here are very tack-sharp (and you added IT tech-sharp) in picking this up. In a LT build, each progress payment is deducted against spent cost, the difference can be taken to profits every payment interval. Usually cost is assessed on the high side, such that a bigger grand profit is taken at time of delivery. This is the norm, I think SB practices this. In the case of the 2 huge builds, customer is gone, any deposits are forfeited to profits. Cost is then capitalised until sale is made, where that huge profit is taken in one-go. Implications, the quarters towards completion will show no profits, all until sale is made. Anyone here know when the 2 ships is complete ? For sure 2024, and even 2025 profits are affected by this, then one big one when sale is made. My mention of escalation cost in contract, no totally bearings to above. It applies if say steel price soars or plunges past a determined level, both parties can adjust sale price to account for it. BinderyT      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 20:00) Posted: Any idea how is WIP in the 2 containers accounted for?   Some industry (like my IT industry) allow for rev and cost to be recognised by milestones.   But since no customer in this case, does it mean they have to temporarilly accrue cost only but no rev? Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 19:36) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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Login20 Master	02-Sep-2024 20:16        Login20 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	I am not familiar with accounting, they mentioned they will proceed to continue with these 2 ship building and sell upon completion, if not wrong completel by 2027.  BinderyT      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 20:00) Posted: Any idea how is WIP in the 2 containers accounted for?   Some industry (like my IT industry) allow for rev and cost to be recognised by milestones.   But since no customer in this case, does it mean they have to temporarilly accrue cost only but no rev? Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 19:36) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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BinderyT Elite	02-Sep-2024 20:00        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Any idea how is WIP in the 2 containers accounted for?   Some industry (like my IT industry) allow for rev and cost to be recognised by milestones.   But since no customer in this case, does it mean they have to temporarilly accrue cost only but no rev? Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 19:36) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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Login20 Master	02-Sep-2024 19:18        Login20 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	I trust YZJSB management will provide very good result. Other matter whatever it is, doesn' t matter.  Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 19:11) Posted: Thank you, no comment.  I long here emailpeter      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 18:57) Posted: Big ticket orders like these, no doubt will have escalation (and de-escalation) clauses over price of raw materials and other significant inputs. Furthermore, ship buyers are at liberty to assign the ships over to others, ownership can change as ship is being built. Evidently, there was one rescind over recent 2 x 175k cwt LNG carrier by a German buyer, for reasons unknown. We are not being too risk averse to encourage all here to keep an eye on any such defaults, foreclosures or cancellations on any future orders. And even a taper off in this very cyclical economy led shipbuilding. It's still blue skies for 5 yrs to 2029, and beyond. Very clear and blue... But long term shareholders are not wrong to project ahead for any red flags.... Cheers and a good evening enjoying so many rides this week..
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Login20 Master	02-Sep-2024 19:11        Login20 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Thank you, no comment.  I long here emailpeter      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 18:57) Posted: Big ticket orders like these, no doubt will have escalation (and de-escalation) clauses over price of raw materials and other significant inputs. Furthermore, ship buyers are at liberty to assign the ships over to others, ownership can change as ship is being built. Evidently, there was one rescind over recent 2 x 175k cwt LNG carrier by a German buyer, for reasons unknown. We are not being too risk averse to encourage all here to keep an eye on any such defaults, foreclosures or cancellations on any future orders. And even a taper off in this very cyclical economy led shipbuilding. It's still blue skies for 5 yrs to 2029, and beyond. Very clear and blue... But long term shareholders are not wrong to project ahead for any red flags.... Cheers and a good evening enjoying so many rides this week... Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 18:07) Posted: Yes, the article mentions economy no good thing like that, especially in China where construction is in bad shape, rebar and steel consumption in construction dropped, but YZJSB already secure so huge order book, so I believe this will support YZJSB margin well.
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emailpeter Veteran	02-Sep-2024 19:01        emailpeter About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Just encouraging more awareness. Rates for containers had risen too high since covid to stratosphere. Some healthy correction to ensure longevity is much welcomed. https://splash247.com/shanghai-futures-market-shows-liner-fortunes-plummeting/
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emailpeter Veteran	02-Sep-2024 18:57        emailpeter About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Big ticket orders like these, no doubt will have escalation (and de-escalation) clauses over price of raw materials and other significant inputs. Furthermore, ship buyers are at liberty to assign the ships over to others, ownership can change as ship is being built. Evidently, there was one rescind over recent 2 x 175k cwt LNG carrier by a German buyer, for reasons unknown. We are not being too risk averse to encourage all here to keep an eye on any such defaults, foreclosures or cancellations on any future orders. And even a taper off in this very cyclical economy led shipbuilding. It's still blue skies for 5 yrs to 2029, and beyond. Very clear and blue... But long term shareholders are not wrong to project ahead for any red flags.... Cheers and a good evening enjoying so many rides this week... Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 18:07) Posted: Yes, the article mentions economy no good thing like that, especially in China where construction is in bad shape, rebar and steel consumption in construction dropped, but YZJSB already secure so huge order book, so I believe this will support YZJSB margin well.  BinderyT      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 17:59) Posted: But iron/steel price going down is usually interpreted as declining economies.   Shouldn' t that be bearish for shipbuilders?   Oh well, I' m not complaining :
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Login20 Master	02-Sep-2024 18:07        Login20 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Yes, the article mentions economy no good thing like that, especially in China where construction is in bad shape, rebar and steel consumption in construction dropped, but YZJSB already secure so huge order book, so I believe this will support YZJSB margin well.  BinderyT      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 17:59) Posted: But iron/steel price going down is usually interpreted as declining economies.   Shouldn' t that be bearish for shipbuilders?   Oh well, I' m not complaining :) Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 17:52) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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BinderyT Elite	02-Sep-2024 17:59        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	But iron/steel price going down is usually interpreted as declining economies.   Shouldn' t that be bearish for shipbuilders?   Oh well, I' m not complaining :) Login20      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 17:52) Posted: --- Post Removed by User ---
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BinderyT Elite	02-Sep-2024 17:55        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Lol! If YZJ go up everytime he talk rubbish, then maybe we should encourage him to continue :) Panda8      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 17:05) Posted: this  dontbetray      ( Date: 30-Aug-2024 12:01) Posted: base on data, its taking a break as fund house have left this counter
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emailpeter Veteran	02-Sep-2024 17:08        emailpeter About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Yes, 2.8, 3.2 and 4.8% today. Yet the Korean shipping side down correspondingly. Not sure if the news of decarbonisation led shipbuilding boom favours the Chinese more ? Yet no as KR is also getting a great share, esp the higher technology engined ships. Maybe the big funds are coming in again to ship building. BinderyT      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 16:20) Posted: Anyone knows what' s the catalyst driving this today?   Both YZJ and Seatrium shooting up like mad.
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Panda8 Veteran	02-Sep-2024 17:05        Panda8 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	this  dontbetray      ( Date: 30-Aug-2024 12:01) Posted: base on data, its taking a break as fund house have left this counter
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BinderyT Elite	02-Sep-2024 16:57        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Meaning? Panda8      ( Date: 02-Sep-2024 16:55) Posted: it is BB want to tell off the idiot don' t know any thing better shut off his stupid mouth. Base on data? what data? which fund house?
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Panda8 Veteran	02-Sep-2024 16:55        Panda8 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 1   x 0  Alert Admin	it is BB want to tell off the idiot don' t know any thing better shut off his stupid mouth. Base on data? what data? which fund house?
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BinderyT Elite	02-Sep-2024 16:20        BinderyT About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Anyone knows what' s the catalyst driving this today?   Both YZJ and Seatrium shooting up like mad.
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